clickers

[Little Miss Purple]

Originally Posted by not dead yet

never thought i'd get so many answers here , but its obvious that only john osf. has the same oppinion as I.

dont think i'll be renewing my coaching cert.

i'm goin back to proper shooting

does that mean you'll stop bitching about coaching???

[grimsby archer]

Originally Posted by Chris B

However, as much as i love clickers (who doesn't?), i wouldn't be... brave.. enough to attempt to teach 40-odd people to use clickers at the same time, with arrows no-where near the right length (2 - 5" too long). Another problem is that they dont often use the same kit this practice that they used last practice.

I was just thinking the same thing

[hooktonboy]

Originally Posted by not dead yet

never thought i'd get so many answers here , but its obvious that only john osf. has the same oppinion as I.

Okay, Okay!! From your options (rather than mine) and if I was advising someone else (rather than pleasing myself) - I would advise "when their form is consistent".No real point to it otherwise.

If you're not renewing your cert then I guess coaching around here won't be getting easier to find - wouldn't that leave us with about 6 (more or less newly qualified) level ones only? (and a few in training perhaps).

Proper shooting....? Or compound....?

[Little Miss Purple]

Originally Posted by hooktonboy

Okay, Okay!! From your options (rather than mine) and if I was advising someone else (rather than pleasing myself) - I would advise "when their form is consistent".No real point to it otherwise.

If you're not renewing your cert then I guess coaching around here won't be getting easier to find - wouldn't that leave us with about 6 (more or less newly qualified) level ones only? (and a few in training perhaps).

Proper shooting....? Or compound....?

compound... he can get the scores with that

[Little Miss Purple]

I didn't get my clicker until I was more consistant

[hooktonboy]

Originally Posted by Little Miss Purple

compound... he can get the scores with that

[ASW1973]

I think that there is some confusion as to what a clicker is for which leads to its delay in use. The first miss-aprehension is that the clicker is an adjunct that can be added later, sadly no. Let us consider the idea that if you can not use a clicker then you are not shooting "properly, secondly this idea of draw length "settling in". The only reason that draw length may vary is because a clicker is not being used and draw length should be assesed and set within the first dozen arrows shot. At its most basic a clicker makes the archer NOT drift forward before loose (a common error that is prevalent amongst those not using a clicker). Using a clicker is based around alignement and good technique, so what is the point in not driving this technique forward from the outset...... by using a clicker.

[TJ Mason]

Originally Posted by ASW1973

...At its most basic a clicker makes the archer NOT drift forward before loose (a common error that is prevalent amongst those not using a clicker).

I've seen plenty of evidence to the contrary - archers who collapse when the clicker drops, so their draw hands shoot forward before loose. Then very often they'll flutter the draw hand around so their fingers are touching the back of the neck, and they convince themselves that they had a nice follow-through. And I've seen plenty of archers without a clicker who don't have any such collapse or forward loose.
Alignment is key to avoiding a collapse or forward loose. That can most certainly be taught without a clicker.

[Chris B]

Originally Posted by John (OSF)

There's no doubt that you are far more knowledgeable ASW so I 'am' listening, the thing that I find hardest to uinderstand is where the time comes from to try and set-up a beginner to shoot with a clicker, as in the early stages some will not draw to their face and others draw behind their ears no matter what you try and do.

Spot on.
Its easier said than done. We are all experienced archers and we understand the importance of introducing a clicker in the early stages, but in practice its not that easy. Beginners will have all manner of.. unique interpretations of seemingly simple instructions and demonstrations.

ASW, have you successfully acheived this in normal, practical conditions; eg. beginners course day one, 30-40 beginners, 4:1 ratio of beginners to instructors, with kit commonly available to average clubs? who, if anyone, has ever acheived this with good results, or ever could?

[ASW1973]

rhys has a document i wrote on how to run structured novice training and what is looked for in a university setting, i have taught clicker use to groups of 8 students in a short session regularly and they have all left the session using the clicker. on a one to one basis i always teach archers to use clicker within half an hour of them starting.
so chris in answer to your question it is not difficult it is all about how you teach. I agree that it is not possible in some cases because the instructors are not capable of seeing that individual differences are not as acceptable as people would like them to be. it is just about a structured training regime that novices fit into not fitting the structure to novices