Our problems...

[napolienne]

Originally Posted by BorderBows

That is the million dollar question. Each company does it a little different. So we would not tell our way, but other methodologies are apparent in other companies marketing. So thats one we would like to shy away from, which is why you probably didint get much of a reply.

Ah, trade secrets . Fair enough.

[Nick Forster]

I feel that limb manufacturers have chased speed a little too much, Torsional stiffness in the limbs has been sacrificed in search of this holy grail.
A few year ago I was seduced by the speed bug and at first I feel that this worked for me, now I am of the opinion that if you can keep a reasonable sight mark IE:- your sight is extended out on its mounting arm and you have at least 3/4" of adjustment left on pin height ( you have plenty of power to shoot in any conditions) then stiffness is the way to go.
I shoot KG Apex Limbs and I like them a lot, but I do wish that they were a little stiffer at present shooting ace's I have an arrow speed of around 220fps with 44lbs on my fingers Lovely and quick fantastic sight marks But they are not forgiving they reward a good release fantasticaly, but they punish you if you get it wrong. I would happily lose 5-7fps for more stability
I also have some of BB's TXG's in the house hold I feel these are a more stable Limb and have been very impressed with the way they shoot, A stiffer TXG or hex 5 would be of interest to me.
I have also been shooting an old Stylist Safire recently this is a slug of a bow in comparison to the KG but it is so forgiving. I am still not convinced on the ILF priciple and stylist seem to be the only company that seem to have kept away from the ILF limb system and have stuck with a boyered bow. I would be very interested in a modern Target recurve with bolt up limbs, it would be nice to others as well as the stylist.
Nick
Got my Bowman now insearch of MB and stability would help

[Schme1440]

I dont think limbs have become torsionally less stiff compared to the increase in speed. I use to have a set of carbon wood limbs by marksman on S3 risers. I could twist them like jelly. I now have winnex limbs and I cant twist them nearly half as much as I use to. I may be missing the point but it seems to me that top end limbs are much more stiff accross the limb then they use to be.

[BorderBows]

in reply to dealers, We have two items that help UK and other dealers.
on the first note. We have a expert dealer program which we help dealers learn our product. That allows them to be qualified to sell good service to there customers based on our product range. There is nothing to far beyond a good dealer that is prepaired understand a product range in this new offer. Do you think you are being sold a good product by a shop that only stocks understands one brand? If even understands the principals behind what they are selling you.

At least a dealer that stocks and understands our new custom limb system, would understand the competition better too?

On the second note, We have now started holding stock to help our dealers make faster choices. The UK especialy seems to buy what is in stock.

This is what we are doing to support your local dealer. We cant help it your dealer opts to buy all their stock from one distributor to make there invoicing easer. That doesnt give you a good choice of product. do you think buying all your food from one shop gives you the best options, then why shoun't the dealer do the same...

We have noticed that we have gone from 5% direct sales, to 30% direct due to the the internet. But where there is a good dealer we dont get any enquiries from that region. The UK has the pleasure of us on there door step, but we still see 65% dealer sales in the UK.
We have walked away from distributers due to increased UK taxes and employment issues. We have worked out that 48% of the bow you buy from us is TAX, that means they make more than anyone in the archery supply chain.

[BorderBows]

Hex5: Most advanced Recurve design, stores more energy
Hex4: Less recurve built in the design, with more energy than the TX.
TX: Traditional Recurve Design, With excellent speed, and stability

W: Wood core, bamboo, or Maple (bamboo optional)
H: Hyperflex. specificaly dimensionaly temperature stable core. Light weight responsive core that is not a Syntactic foam.

Black: A solid colour finish, lightest weight: Standard on Target Limbs, (camo optional)
GL: Wood vaneer finish, Optional

VX: 60% Torsional stiffness increase over standard
CXC: Prototype (at present) TX40 Replacement, Lighter and stiffer.


__________________________________________________ ________

This at the moment is all conceptial. You need to pick one from each line to make a limb... Simple or complicated?

__________________________________________________ ________

Reasoning:

We are getting feedback that the TX limb is better for string walking... so its more tolerant to off balance loadings.
Hex5 is faster than the TX seriers and smoother due to draw force curve. this is more suitable to those wanting to carry speed at longer distances.

The stiffness benefits are well documented for stabilised bows. So the stiffer the better? but is that the case for barebow?

temperture stable core means less adjustments in sight marks during the days shooting. Lighter core also makes the limb more responsive, Speed and reduction in vibration.



Rocket science or archery?

[bkupris]

The diagram on it's own would be confusing but with your explanation it is very clear. Neat idea to have all those choices and I don't recall seeing anything like it from other manufacturers?

[pHz]

like brian said - needs the verbal explanation / key but aside from that i really like the idea

with the caveat that any dealers NEED the depth of product knowledge to be able to advise / guide (less experienced) customers to the most suitable choices

slainte rob

[worthipa]

Just out of interest, how do the Merlin Elites fit into this scenario?

What characteristics were they designed to have?

[BorderBows]

The Merlin elite was in effect the ML2. The ML2 was the successor to the XP10 Evolution. It has the hyperflex core, and has the tx recurve. It has a more conventional XP10 carbon with bow glass. so performance increases would be found in Lighter laminates and higher torsional rigidity. So a increase in speed and stability. With a smoother shoot cycle.

[krela]

It strikes me that you could do a simple flash application to put on your website that could ask a few simple questions then calculate say 2 sample combinations for them to try.

This would give a starting point to narrow down the options at least.