Unfair to women

[Old Bloke]

I have thought for some time now (about 30 years) that women get unfair treatment when it comes to club shooting days or even tournament days. Let me explain.
When the newbies (or not so newbies) are encouraged to take on their first tournament (Such as Grand Day in the DCAS) all archers are encouraged to take on the National round (4dz @ 60yds 2dz @ 50yds) and outside of the tournament environment most clubs stick a target at 60yds for a *fun shoot*. The thing is, the placing of a target at 60yds is the final distance for a man who would be expected to shoot a York ( 6dz @ 100yds, 4dz @ 80yds 2dz @ 60yds) in a full tournament. The final distance for women on a Hereford (said to be the ladies equivalent to a York)( 6dz @ 80yds, 4dz @ 60yds, 2dz @ 50yds) is shot at 50yds. So why is it that women newbies are forced to shoot at their mid distance (off a Hereford) while the men newbies are allowed to shoot at their final distance off a York? Strikes me as being pretty unfair. What should happen at the Natioanl round and those fun shoots at the club is that either the men shoot at 80yds and women at 60yds or men shoot at 60yds and women 50yds to keep the balance of the customary York/Hereford competitions.
As I say, it is pretty unfair to ask women noobs, to shoot at their mid distance when men get it easy and shoot at their final distance.
I guess it is because in the majority of cases men run shoots and haven't considered the imbalance to women archers.

[Schme1440]

This is also true at the top level. Head to head rounds and 70m rounds are shot at 70meters. This is the Second distance for Men but the First Distance for women. In accordance with your theory then the womens head to head and 70m rounds should be competed at 60m. I know they are of a higher standard but the principals are still the same.

However we dont ask women to compete against men so its not as if the men have an advantage over the women, score wise yes but not for placings.

But I still do agree and maybe women beginers (less than 1 years experience) should shoot 1 distance less than men.

[pelican]

?????????

What is this "forced to shoot" c**p?

Tournaments are something an archer chooses to enter, there is no force involved. It's nothing to do with longest distance or not and everything to do with, am I able to reach this distance? if I can then I might just enter the competition!

Just be glad you don't shoot in Scotland, why waste a competition day on a round that is only 6 doz arrows, mostly it's the full 12 doz up here.

[Old Bloke]

O'h dear, it would appear I have been politically incorrect by using the term "forced to shoot". Yes of course I would agree that no-one is forced to shoot but possibly "positively encouraged to shoot" would be a better term but I still think there is an imbalance that women shoot their mid distance and men shoot their final distance. Should it not be of equal standing based on the 12 dozen rounds?
All I'm suggesting is that the newbies are treated with equal fairness over the distances they shoot based on the usage of York/Hereford distances. As I have said, if men shoot their final distance why shouldn't women do the same?

[PorlyP]

Personally, I don't see the problem.

noobs are noobs are noobs, and 60 yards at first is a challenge for anyone new to the sport.

What would you guys say is the problem with women shooting at the same distance as guys? What do we have that they don't? It's not a pure strength sport now, is it? Technique is just as important, moreso imho than strength. Poundage can sometimes get you around technique in a way, but with good technique, anyone can beat anyone, irrespective of gender. That's what I love about this sport.

I'm intrigued what you base it on, aside from the York/Hereford thing, which for me makes no real point in this argument, imho.

When everyone's starting out, why not have more equality anyway? When we all begin, we all shoot the same distances, then move up.

For a first club champs, I don't see the problem in everyone shooting the same round, whether it's a national or a short national for noobs.

[Flying Whale]

Originally Posted by PorlyP

Personally, I don't see the problem.

noobs are noobs are noobs, and 60 yards at first is a challenge for anyone new to the sport.

What would you guys say is the problem with women shooting at the same distance as guys? What do we have that they don't? It's not a pure strength sport now, is it? Technique is just as important, moreso imho than strength. Poundage can sometimes get you around technique in a way, but with good technique, anyone can beat anyone, irrespective of gender. That's what I love about this sport.

I'm intrigued what you base it on, aside from the York/Hereford thing, which for me makes no real point in this argument, imho.

When everyone's starting out, why not have more equality anyway? When we all begin, we all shoot the same distances, then move up.

For a first club champs, I don't see the problem in everyone shooting the same round, whether it's a national or a short national for noobs.

I think the difficulty comes because a relatively new archer does not always have a feeling for what to expect.

Lets say 2 new archers (1 lady, 1 gent) shoot a national round....

The lady shoots 350
The Gent shoots 420

What do they feel? Does the lady feel "I am not going to make it at archery, look how much better he is doing?" I hope not. If you look at the classifications she shot a 2nd class score, he only shot a 3rd class.

It is hard when you take up archery to really work out how to gauge things, unless you are lucky to have supportive mentors around you.


My view. I don't think anybody is forced to shoot, but I think new archers must be given the support to ensure they don't get disillusioned and drop out!

I've never understood the need for different score level for indoor class

I know some guys that shoot lighter bows than the women (you know who you are) maybe they should classify by poundage and sex test some of the men?

[Flying Whale]

Originally Posted by McCaig

I've never understood the need for different score level for indoor class

I know some guys that shoot lighter bows than the women (you know who you are) maybe they should classify by poundage and sex test some of the men?

Me for one! And I also score less than a lot of the women (and juniors) at tournaments

But you try and do and do a sex test on me, and you know exactly where you will find my light poundage bow!!!

Would that be among the ladies?

Loads of women and juniors are better archers than me too but who cares? It's only a hobby after all (I wish I believed that)

[hypertigger]

Originally Posted by McCaig

I've never understood the need for different score level for indoor class

I know some guys that shoot lighter bows than the women (you know who you are) maybe they should classify by poundage and sex test some of the men?

a pants idea in my opinion, but then again my opinion