Cleve York

[clickerati]

Better yet, put them in the DropBox!

[its my party and]

Originally Posted by Old Bloke

The results are in and as I suspected...all those under the trees..top scores..and the further you went from the trees..the worse the scores.
Ho hum..I did pretty well then being towards the windy end of the line. Next time at Cleve (and at the same venue)..must slip the tournament organiser a fiver to be on target 1..but only when the wind is from the South West, West or North West. If the wind is from any other direction..I'll spend the fiver on cake.

Sounds to me old bloke like sour grapes having a go at the tournament organisers because of your disappointments! I actually asked to be situated as close to the Bristol rounds as possible but I didn't get what I wanted either. With so much experience you should know a tournament organisers life is not an easy one what with people asking to move targets and placing banners without initially asking. They probably thought best to ignore all requests no preference for anyone its fairer that way. As for the conditions and as the wind was predominantly from behind all day how can you tell your target was so much harder than target 1. Target 1 was 6 mtrs from the tree line. There was approx 2mtrs between ctrs of targets meaning yours was approx 26mtrs from the tree line. Target No 8 was therefore at 20 mtrs from the trees. I was on target no 3 12 mtrs from the trees.
if we look at it Recurve
Target No 8 1st 1088
Target No 7 2nd place 1071
Target No 6 3rd place 1020
Me target No 3 8th place 974
But there was also target No 12 7th place 978
And you in amongst the top scores on target no 11 6m from the highest score scored. You are entitled to your opinions but firstly remember a tournament organisers life is not an easy one and insinuating if you slip them a fiver you will somehow be at an advantage at future tournaments is just wrong. I have only been shooting 8% of the time you have been shooting but I can tell you every archer has to shoot to the conditions they are faced with at the time of shooting. Whether they be 6m to the left of you and winning by 110 points or 2m to the right and 4 points below your score. All you have done is belittle your fellow archers efforts on the day because you were in the middle of the field and you weren't happy because you think you had considerably worse conditions to contend with than someone who won the competition by a hugh margin yet was 6 mtrs away from you. Your also belittling my efforts and others on the day by stating I had an advantage due to my in your opinion favourable target position on the day. As this is an open forum please provide proof of the advantage I gained and your disadvantage on the day in relation to the winner who was 6 mtrs from you, shot in the same place as last year whan the conditions were worse and put 76 points on his score from last year. Or revisit your previous comments please.

[Old Bloke]

Dear Jock,

I am not belittling my fellow archers!!!!! All I am doing is pointing out why those some of those archers might not have shot to their usual standard if their score was down on where it should have been and not realise why.!!!!Good grief! Are you saying that the huge bank of trees did not help those archers under the cover of it??
My God, the wind was from the South West and as the rain passed turned to the West which the trees gave protection from. If there is another shoot at Cleve and the same conditions apply and the field on the gents side is put out in the same way, then I am sorry, those archers on target 1 through to 8 will have an advantage because of the protection given by the bank of dense trees. What the organisers should do, is to reverse the layout so that the juniors and those shooting the National round are offered the protection, keep the ladies where it is and the gents line near the running track completely in the open thus not offering any potential advantage with the wind direction as above.
Concerning your own performance on the day, I congratulate you, but a word of warning..if you had not taken into consideration that the bank of trees might have been a help to you on the day, and that on a similar day's weather and wind you do not achieve the same level of score but worse..what are you going to think? You probably will think you had a bad day when in fact you were shooting to the same form but because of the conditions had arrows blow all over the place and not come in with the score you had thought you were going to get....and as such confidence erroded.
If anyone attends Cleve in the future and meet the same conditions and who have read this forum entry, will now be aware of the situation as I see it from
my many years of experience in archery, and might adjust their thinking or shooting accordingly and will benefit from it.
If you see my comments as belittleing rather than as pointing out the bl**dy obvious, then I'm sorry...I'm off this forum.
Good bye.

[John (OSF)]

Everyone handles the wind in a different way, I was shooting in glagow 2 years ago(car park end) and we had a gale blowing at us but and the next target was calm (we thought that a witch must have been burnt at our end as it was unvelievable).

At the end of that shoot archers were saying that the end with tree cover was the best to shoot at in windy conditions (but it didn't seem to bother Mr N too much)
Might be that a more experienced archer would know how many points they lost because of the wind better than somebody of less experience (who's to say? as i think you both have valid points)
As a York is shot mostly at 100yds then it seems reasonable that gusty weather would have a greater effect.

Anyway, nothing wrong with a bit of competiton and verbal sparring that can always be sorted out on the shooting line, keep posting, as we need experienced guys commited to archery like both of you on here, otherwise it's just going to threads about coaches arguing about clickers
(now that's an idea )

[buzz lite beer]

There are many a outdoor shoot that has it's "indoor range", I have fell lucky on just a few occasions and realised this was the case and used it too my advantage outscoring archers I have never come close to before, like wise I have put in lower scores to those archers of a similar stamp to me when circumstances have been reversed. Sometimes the playing field is a far far place away from equal

[Furface]

There are very few grounds that do not have "advantageous" positions, banking and trees being particularly influential. As each archer has only shot once, in the position they were allocated, it is meaningless to say that, because A shot a higher score than B neither or both was affected by conditions. The only meaningful comment is as OB said, "I, as an individual, believe that my shooting was affected by the conditions I had at my shooting point, which would have been different at another shooting point". And we have all written things like that in our shooting diaries "Shot poorly, wind put me off". As I understand it, target positions are meant to be allocated purely at random anyway. And we have all made light-hearted jokes about "slipping a fiver" to get something done.

[cornish george]

Originally Posted by Old Bloke

Dear Jock,

Are you saying that the huge bank of trees did not help those archers under the cover of it??

Certainly did'nt help me on target 4, scored less than last year on the same target! Even the compounders were struggling.

[tel]

Having had a 'heads-up' that an issue existed......
I expected to get home and be able to go through the varied and informed opinions and be able to form an opinion of my own - apparently not.
The informed opinions are now apparently either deleted or hidden which sort of makes a nonsense of an open forum.
Only the select few are entitled to an opinion apparently...kinda goes back to the coach/archer argument oft thrown about....a coach isn't by necessity a good archer and a good archer sure as hell doesn't make a good coach.

(posted here because that's where it started! )

[Dave]

Tel, can you be more specific as to what you're talking about. I've been through this thread and there's no 'hidden' or 'deleted' messages.

Originally Posted by tel

Having had a 'heads-up' that an issue existed......
I expected to get home and be able to go through the varied and informed opinions and be able to form an opinion of my own - apparently not.
The informed opinions are now apparently either deleted or hidden which sort of makes a nonsense of an open forum.
Only the select few are entitled to an opinion apparently...kinda goes back to the coach/archer argument oft thrown about....a coach isn't by necessity a good archer and a good archer sure as hell doesn't make a good coach.

(posted here because that's where it started! )

[tel]

PM sent......in case anyone thought I'd gone to sleep