The Coaches paradox

[BowSurfer]

Another approach that coaches might like to consider, where they feel that people need coaching 'despite themselves', is simply to wander round talking to people about archery. Just talking to people about archery in general, rather than addressing particular faults, can get people to think a bit more about what they are doing and then maybe they would get around to asking for specific help. And chatting about archery is always good to do - which is why this forum is here in the first place.

[Zeb]

I agree with Bowsurfer.
I have returned to shooting after an 18 year gap and want to re-gain my MB, but don't want coaching yet. It took a while to get some muscles back, and my form was messy. I am now working on specific aspects. I get other things quite wrong, but am not interested in fixing them yet. I want to get the good bits automatic as I can only concentrate on a couple of points at a time.
I am very pleased with our club coach who approached to talk about things in general, rather than pointing out my errors. It was a great introduction and helped me feel free to ask for help in my own time.

[simon m]

I noticed at our club even with two qualified coaches & several who have let there coaching certs lapse people still don't ask.

I have had very basic coaching from club members, nothing very technical.
However I am always "discussing" points of form with fellow compounders which helps me learn more about my own form.

HOWEVER when the county coach made a visit one winter evening last year which was designated a "coaching" evening He was MOBBED!.

About eight recurvers all said they'd like to be assessed by him!.

MAYBE its easier to take critism(cause ultimately thats what it is(good critism!))
From a relative stranger rather than someone you shoot with every week?.

[ironmonkey]

there seem to be lots of coaches in this discussion
can i speak from the viewpoint of an archer, pure and simple?

id like to think i'm archery-smart and have a good technique based on current thinking in the sport.

i've had coaching sessions with six or more county (or thereabouts) level GNAS coaches and one National level coach.
only one of them has ever given me a compliment about any part of my technique (National level coach).

they ALL seem to immediately criticise any perceived fault in form.

PLEASE GIVE ARCHERS POSITVE FEEDBACK FIRST!

they make false diagnoses, and go on to explain very poorly the point they are trying to get across. they use only rudimentary and confusing terminology.

PLEASE continue to research into current thinking on technique, beyong your coaching qualifications!

one in particular uses only the same particular piece of advice on anyone, regardless of current technique, shooting discipline, body shape, skill level etc.
it seems that some of them advocate a certain bit of technique (that they current understand to be important) to the cost of all else.

most have never shot anywhere near the scores that i have shot. i realise that this isn't a prerequisite for coaching ability, but it doesn't inspire confidence or respect. if you're a coach please have the humility to recognise an accomplished archer before attempting to demolish his/her technique.

most coaches lost my respect in the first 5 minutes, by either saying something stupid when i asked, or butting in when i didn't ask.
how can you impart knowledge, when the first thing you do is lose the respect of your audience? the archer might put up a barrier; "i don't care how much you think i need it, i don't want it!"

there is a perception that many GNAS coaches are just old blokes who want to show the youngsters how its done.

given what i've said from the point of view of an archer, is it surprising to you that many archers don't want your comments?
if you are an archer in a similar position to me, here are some good replies to get unwanted coaches off your back;
"im working on it.",
"im working on something else right now.",
"i know.." [continue to shoot as before]

however avoid the one my friend tried at Leamington; "p**s off you interfering old fart!"


if coaches take in just one thing from all this, its; please please just give an archer a compliment once in a while. it means alot!

[cliveanne]

Originally Posted by Furface

Last week I turned up expecting to run a "Coaching " session where Coaching is available to those what want it. One archer turned up to shoot. When no one else arrived, I offered to work with him on anything he liked, but he said he knew all his own faults by himself, thanks.
So, a question. Coaches are told not to approach archers with advice or offers to "help". Most archers at my club say they're not interested in being coached, often because they believe it doesn't help. So no opportunities to demonstrate that coaching does help. How do others break this circle?

That rings a bell.
But at other times a certain person will come at me constantly, & I can't get rid.
All or nothing eh?

[grimsby archer]

Originally Posted by simon m

I
HOWEVER when the county coach made a visit one winter evening last year which was designated a "coaching" evening He was MOBBED!.

Is there any relevence in the fact that the visiting coach was "the county coach"? as in, did the archers concerned think the county coach was of a "higher standard" than the local coaches?

I sympathise with furfaces original comments, and have made similar comments myself within these hallowed walls.

I find there is a degree of familiarity breeding contempt at my club as a percentage of the members were there before I came along.
The majority of members think coaches are the people who run beginners courses.
Three years on (nearly) and I am so fed up of the wilderness, I wonder whether to renew my certificate at all!

[Furface]

Originally Posted by grimsby archer

I...
Three years on (nearly) and I am so fed up of the wilderness, I wonder whether to renew my certificate at all!

I will if you will!

[TWIW]

Originally Posted by Furface

I will if you will!

I have the opposite problem. The 2 clubs with the ATC up I started and are both populated with raw beginners, most now in their 2nd winter. I get horrible guilt pangs when I go to the club and just shoot coz I need the practice and don't give them any coaching.

Sadly we are restricted to twice a week for our archery and we often don't get it every week.

Anyone fancy a break up here in Aberdeen to teach a bunch of very willing archers who will hang on your every word?

[Meddler]

Originally Posted by thewayitwas

Anyone fancy a break up here in Aberdeen to teach a bunch of very willing archers who will hang on your every word?

I could be tempted... Weekends are best for me. It would be a good chance for me to go up and se my sister.

[TWIW]

Originally Posted by Meddler

I could be tempted... Weekends are best for me. It would be a good chance for me to go up and se my sister.

We have 2 Sundays in November so far. 18th & 25th.

Also someone from banchory who does the Junior squad wants to come and watch the cadets.