Best personality for archery?

[RoverJohn977]

There is credit in everything that all of you say.

However I think that there are different starting points for the various arguments that are being advanced.

There is much talk of coaching and success and champions - but can't a club shooter demonstrate tenacity?

Surely the person who best demonstrates that quality is not a young fit championship candidate but the individual who is struggling with their own particular demons or with a physical deficit or disability?

As with many sports the top flight of archery is a fascinating spectacle, but the club level is of at least equal importance.

I have attended coaching sessions where it is clear that the view is that the greatest priority of the sport is the very small minority who will shoot at National level and this seems a little short sighted to me.

The majority of the support for our sport (and the associated equipment sales) will come from the middle ground of shooters.

I am writing this whilst watching the Tour de France in the Alps and they are clearly awesome athletes - but I'm not considering giving up cycling because I can't match their performance.

Clicki - It seems clear to me that the personal qualities that define the Champion Archer may well not be those that drive the club archer and as you point out many champions probably dont have the same challenges that others might face.

Just because the person I am shooting against is myself doesnt make me less tenacious.

(It may however keep me more frustrated!)

[phil_r_58]

Originally Posted by Watch_Man

Phil, this reminds me of someone we both know very well. Shot at a high level as a junior but has never been able to repeat his success as an adult. But he has kept at it for the past 30 years and as grimsby_archer has said previously, he is a 'legend in his own lunchtime' for attending a competition nearly every weekend. Simon Terry, who has also known him since he was a junior, suggested he turn to compound! However he refuses to change style and keeps saying he will only swap once he has mastered re curve. He is the only one apart from Wendy who is up at the club nearly every night practising. Come rain or shine, summer, winter and even in the dark using floodlights he is to be found practising. He contributes to archery in the club and in the County and has been one of the main influences in pushing Wendy forward into competitive archery.

He may not have won any major championship or gone above County representation, but he has contributed more to archery in our County than many who have achieved success. His 'tenacity' is something which we all could learn from.

Trev, he is not tenacious in that sense. He is a person who shoots because of the pleasure he gets, and sticks with re-curve because it satisfies his needs. He knows what he wants, and has attained personal satisfaction and contentment, a rare thing. And as such is a man to envy. Like his dad really.

Just like he does not attend field shoots very often, because they simply don't interest him, he would rather be at home, re-fletching for the next weeks GNAS shoot, his mum told me once. And I totally agree, he has contributed more than many to the success of others. he is still there, I would suggest from a bedrock of "contentment" rather than tenacity or ambition.

I could name a long list of "one off merchants" who have won national, European and World titles, that have done it once, then disappeared into oblivion. Or those who do one big one a year, then 364 other days of excuses! While you know who is always there. His quietness however masks his success, he is still a regular at the medal table! He would score more points with compound, but would he be be as satisfied? I think not.

[Anna K]

Originally Posted by Deadeye Doc

If ASW is going to get tecchnical I'd like him to comment on the theory of Personality propounded by Alfred Adler. Simply put, we develop, as children, to some extent depending upon the position in the family, and some other family dynamics. For example, first children have certain characteristics developed because of having been, for at least part of their childhood, an "only" child. Subsequent children may develop a more competitive nature. Now, this is only a very -- and I stress VERY -- simplistic and sketchy outline of Adler's theory, but nevertheless it was popular, and still is, among educationalists.

It would be interesting to know just how the "position" of an individual in their family relates to how "competitive" an Archer they have become. Was the individual always competitive within the family? The thread has so far been dealing with tenacity, although outlined by ASW above are some of the other features of "competitiveness" such as "want", "Drive", and so on, matched by physical characteristics depending to some extent upon the sport chosen, in this case archery.

Interesting, however like all things I think the "position" in the family is more than just eldest child. For example, I am the eldest child and am far more competitive than my younger sister. Part of this will be from always being compared to her "2nd best", and always competing with my father. But, this means that I work harder and longer to get to be to the level that I want. But that is an important point - I wanted to get straight A's at A level (when I was living at home) and I got it, went to uni and the competitive pressure came off and I didn't want a 1st and guess what - didn't work as hard. So wanting the end result is as important as being competitive in the first place.

Also, I agree with ASW, in that I fully believe that I would be far better than I am now, and be improving faster, if I had proper professional coaching. And I imagine that this is the case for an awful lot of people out there.

[addo]

This may upset a few characters.

I've read this thread with increasing interest.I've seen that certain persons have a desire to be right on this subject for what ever reason.The thread seems to have got overly(spelling) complex because of this.Here in lies the answer IMO.

The "best" personality for archery or any sport is perhaps one that DESIRES.Or would that be to simple for some of you? Of course thats to simple.You could name any trait you could think of and there would be other traits involved in making that trait possible.There surley isn't a "best" personality.Anyone could become a good archer regardless of personality.

If desire doesn't do it for some of you,then how about patient or persistent or show off.

[Watch_Man]

This has proven to be one of the more interesting threads of late.

I would say from my own observations that the following are important:

Ability to switch off from the surroundings and concentrate on the shot sequence without being distracted. I would also say with this, an ability to visualize and to use visualization in the 'live' environment of the archery competition.

Ability to analyse and clearly identify specific issues at an early stage and be able to correct them. An example of this is F1 racing, can you imagine if Driver X came back into the pits and said to his engineer -'well it was a bit woolly on the corner near the duck pond', he needs to be able to tell his engineers precisely what the problems are. Similarly with top archers they need to be able to translate what they see through their peep, or feel at full draw and either resolve it themselves or communicate what they feel and see into terms that can be understood by their coach. I have experienced this with John Dudley who is probably the master at this.

Have a 'thick skin' and not be too bothered by what others think. As has been pointed out by other contributors, performance goes up and down. The best archers deal with the down as well as they do with the up. Our top archers will float within a 'band of success' and appreciate that from one competition to another they will not necessarily be top each time. If they are 1st one week and 4th the next then it won't really affect them as they will only be interested and focussed on their own performance.

Be able to accept that archery is just as much about psychology and mental strength as it is about physical performance. Without exception, every top archer I have been fortunate enough to talk too realises this. Yet at club level it is often very difficult to persuade up and coming archers of its importance. So someone with an open mind to new ideas.

Individual coaching is without doubt a major factor and there is no doubt that good coaching is one of the most important factors. However it is also important that the archer is able to take on board what the coach says. Someone with the ability to take instruction.

I would also say good equipment, well tuned and maintained is important because if the archer is confident in their kit it may help give them the extra confidence which may not necessarily come naturally to them.

These are just my own thoughts and not based on anything other than observations, I certainly don't claim to be qualified to give an opinion but there are plenty on here who are.

[not dead yet]

thinking about this thread...........

think dual personality.

mad, humerous , fun , happy...........off the line.

controlled, focussed, charged...........on the line


people who i think fit this catogory.

plz correct me if i'm wrong.

Me, ASW, LMP. ,d hunter. rob hallw. greydog, bulldog. splitter. saphire's hubby. andrea g. vicky g.
to name but a few

any ideas on this one

[chemistry]

With regards to the tenacity arguement, I'd sum it up as "Winners never quit and quitters never win".

IMHO doing anything at a high level requires the desire and mental toughness to stick at it and keep striving to do better. In my experience, whilst they may enjoy what they do and have 'fun', the top people in any given field are never satisfied with their performance and always want to do that little bit better.

chemistry

[ASW1973]

this leads to an area that I have touched upon in other posts:
This level of emotional investment seen even in some "club" archers as well as internationalists leads the athlete open to great emotional damage. Many of the people on this board have suffered from "the dark side of sport" the unhappiness and emotional trauma of poor performance. This is one of the major areas that I work with athletes in. The level of emotional damage can be akin to bereavement in extreme cases leading to destructive behaviors to themselves and those around them. Not recognising how these feelings can spiral quickly out of control is very dangerous. the emotional impact of poor performance can not be overcome by simply practicing more, in fact this may be even more destructive.
So, perversely, the traits that make the successful, successful, also cause individuals to be the least effective at dealing with failure.

[The Meggy]

Maybe speaking as someone with maybe only average tenacity, I'm better at dealing with failure . However, ASW I would be interested to know whether one's tenacity can be improved, and if so how, or is it something which tends to be "set in stone" after a certain age. Also, for those used to high levels of success, can they get better at dealing with the occassional "failure", also how?

[Furface]

Originally Posted by ASW1973

this leads to an area that I have touched upon in other posts:
This level of emotional investment seen even in some "club" archers as well as internationalists leads the athlete open to great emotional damage. Many of the people on this board have suffered from "the dark side of sport" the unhappiness and emotional trauma of poor performance. This is one of the major areas that I work with athletes in. The level of emotional damage can be akin to bereavement in extreme cases leading to destructive behaviors to themselves and those around them. Not recognising how these feelings can spiral quickly out of control is very dangerous. the emotional impact of poor performance can not be overcome by simply practicing more, in fact this may be even more destructive.
So, perversely, the traits that make the successful, successful, also cause individuals to be the least effective at dealing with failure.

I can recognise this in several (ex)club archers, from relative beginner to relative expert. Two questions, ASW: does the bereavement-like situation (excellent analogy!) appear through the same phases as other emotional "losses", or does it tend to stick in one phase (disbelief or anger); does this imply that another characteristic of the uber-archer is the willingness to accept psycho-therapeutic intervention, or can such interventions be made without an athletes full awareness ("....but they must WANT to change")?