the bent back bow arm

[geoffretired]

Some arms can bend backwards at the elbow. At full draw, it looks very uncomfortable and the elbow is often very close to the string path.
Should the archer be encouraged to shoot with a straight arm? To my way of thinking the elbow joint is having pressure put on it that is tending to bend it even more. Is that straining the joint I wonder?
Will having the bones in line allow the archer to be relaxed in the bow arm or will more muscles need to be used to hold it straight?

[LineCutter]

These archers have hypermobile joints: more prone to strain/damage because of this. Not straining the wrong side of the elbow would seem to be a good thing.

But... how do you sort out the level of "straightness" that you are after? A bracer on the inner arm would prevent an arm from bending too far, so should they shoot with a bracer on the "wrong" side??

Get them to shoot compound

[geoffretired]

Thanks for that Line Cutter. It looks like strain is there, to me when I see this happening.
If I had to choose, I would ask for a straight looking arm. That would require the person concerned to "bend" the arm inwards from the fully bent position that they can reach. I wondered how unstable that would be for the archer. I can only imagine that the bow arm would be inclined to bend either way from straight and that might cause real problems with stability. I'm undecided here.

[buzz lite beer]

hyper-extension of the bow arm should be reduced as much as posible, keeping bones in line means less muscle involvement, plus prevents string clearance problems and bruises, It's hard going for anyone with the condition and is going to be somthing extra to keep in check but it is the way to go, obviously pain should be considered and muscle development in the form of free weights and gym work can help stabilize the elbow even more.

[geoffretired]

Thanks Buzz, I was a bit concerned with several of the issues you mentioned there.

[GreenSteve]

This is a problem that affects my daughter when she is shooting
we were told that it is more commen with females due to one of those anatomical differences between male/female, and indeed the only other person i`ve seen shooting with this problem is female, and they do both occasionally recieve some rather nasty bruises just above the elbow.

In my daughters case it`s something that is proving very difficult to correct she tends to lock her arm for the draw as even 16lb is quite heavy for her at age 11, but she is also aware of the fault and as she grows and gains strength it will correct (+ she`s shooting JMB scores so we`re happy) and the bruises give something to show off at school

Also i did run a small experiment at work out of 10 blokes only one had this "Ability/Defect"

[WhitehartFB]

I know that this is not an answer to the problem, but if the shooting position is causing brusing to the upper arm should you not use an arm guard that protects this area such as the Gompy AB1.

Although this does not work in every case I have got archers to slightly bend the bow arm just enough to keep control of the elbow using the following method.

Without a bow get the archer RH to put their left arm across their body and touch their opposite shoulder with the palm of the hand, then extend the arm out to the full draw position setting the bow hand at 45 degrees. For some people this sets the elbow in training it can be replicated with the bow in hand. This can also help with keeping the bow shoulder down.

[geoffretired]

Green Steve, can I ask what your daughter is doing to correct the difficulty?
You say it is proving difficult; is she trying to shoot with the arm straight, for example?
Whitehart, Can I ask more questions about the changes you make to the bent back elbow? When the archer shoots with the slightly bent arm(bent forwards not backwards I assume) what difficulties do they face? Does the arm collapse perhaps or is it difficult to maintain the same degree of bend or ....?
Thanks to all for the help so far.

[WhitehartFB]

Yes the elbow has a slight bend away from the string.

This approach can lead to a collapsed shot, however rather than teaching pushing as a cure, try and teach stability in the arm not moving (by setting up the rest of the shot correctly on the shoulders), until the arrow hits the target.

I think one of the problems is that many instrutors in all cases advocate a pushing motion with the bow hand through the shot. This action and shooting with a straight or potentially over stretched arm leads to the rotation of the elbow joint inwards and in many cases this is compounded by the bow shoulder rising putting the whole shot sequence out of line.The final part of the equasion is that the archer is sometimes over bowed and all these symptons are exagerated in an attempt to hold the bow, where the bow arm should be relaxed but stable the archer is having to use up too much energy and bow arm tension controlling the shot.
Finally, Correct bone on bone alignment (detailed in Rick's book) generally offers greater stability and consistancy over a long days shooting rather relying just on muscle, however IMHO creating good line which in turn promotes accuracy and setting the elbow so that regular injury from the string is eliminated is more important than keeping the status quo and accepting injury as just one of those things. Not least on safety grounds but also for the enjoyment of the sport.

[geoffretired]

Whitehart, thanks a lot for all the advice.
I see what you are saying about pushing to the target and holding the bowarm in a stable position.
I often think of the bow arm as a one -piece part of the archer. To keep the bow away from the face, or facing the gold, I think of the whole arm rotating at the shoulder in a left direction, like a clock placed flat on the ground and one hand moving backwards from 11 o'clock towards 12. (right handed archer)
The arm doesn't rotate because of the opposing forces, but it does make the back muscles work and it keeps the bow at a uniform distance from the head.
Any thoughts on that idea?