Bareshaft Impacts

[BowSurfer]

The main point is that bareshaft tuning is just the start of the process. It gets you into the right area. Then you tune for groups - having done that, you can look at where the bareshaft goes so that you can do a quick bareshaft tune to get get back to the optimal settings quickly if something in your setup has changed.
At longer distances it is not recomended to tune nock height using bareshaft due to the drag effects - button tuning can however be extended to long distances.

[not dead yet]

every april i go out on a calm day and do bare shaft tuning, moving backwards,once i'm at 90mtrs and happy with the bare shaft, i will fine tune at 70mtrs. once i'm happy with the group i will go back to 90 and see where the bare shaft lies. it is always in the 3/4 at 12 o clock. then on another calm day i will shoot a doz at every distance, yds / mtrs. to get allmy sight marks. i then know that if my sight is low at 90 it will also be low at 70.
does any of that make sense

[Quadratus]

I was taught the "low left" thing long before anyone had heard of Jay Barrs.

The reason given by my instructor (who had been shooting since the 1940's) was that no one and nothing is perfect, particularly at the end of a hard day's shooting, so you should always err on the side of caution. Slightly stiff arrows will still group well, but even slightly weak is a disaster, so tune so your arrow a little stiff. Similarly, a low nocking point leads to fouling the rest, while a slightly high one is fine, so set your nocking point a little high.

I wonder if this is the origin of "low left" - a bit of practical advice taken out of context? And by the way, restated slightly differently as "never high, never right" it is advice I still follow.

PS - Shirt? Tuning? Naaah......

[Murray]

Never mind bareshaft at 70m, walkbacks, etc. By far the best results out of any of the tuning methods I've come across are the ones which start and finish by tuning the archer

[not dead yet]

Originally Posted by Murray

Never mind bareshaft at 70m, walkbacks, etc. By far the best results out of any of the tuning methods I've come across are the ones which start and finish by tuning the archer

but murray havn't you read the posts regarding coaches......how do you tune the archer......pmsl

the best way is ask the people at the top.....one thing i do know practice makes perfect....unfortunately we all have to work

i did it my way.....Quote from frank

[Duss]

In order to avoid weight, balance (and FOC) problems during bareshaft tuning, some people, among them myself, tend to use bareshafts that have been "weight adjusted".

That simply means that we add some sticky tape where the fletching is on the fletched arrows. The position, length and quantity of that tape is adjusted so that all arrows have the same weight AND FOC, be they fletched or unfletched.

[Duss]

Some "old" archers I know tune so that their bareshafts hit at 2 o'clock (above and rightish)

[7,3,miss]

Thanks for all the replies and opinions.

I know that:-

Rough tune - bareshaft in group
Fine tune - bareshaft used as indicator and reference for quick retuning.

But I wanted to know WHY rather than how.

I had it in my head that things were the way they are for the same reasons as Quadratus but just wanted to know what others thought.

High nocking point = better clearance but arrow hits low
Stiff arrows still group well. The fact that a bareshaft should act slightly stiffer than a fletched one would also give you the left of group impact.

There will always be the same number of methods as there are archers to shoot them, but when somebody asks me why the books say that the group should be low/left I would like to be able to give them a better answer than "Because they do"

What is interesting is that there does seem to be some sort of misinformation going about as a result of faulty interpretation of Jay Barrs tuning results. In all honesty, I cant see this slipping past the radar of top archers and coaches for this amount of time. Is this really the case?

As the Low/left thing is mentioned in Total Archery, Heretic Archer, Simple Art of Winning, Steve Ellisons papers, Tuning for Tens, The Glade, Easton Tuning Guide and a host of other publications/ websites, the question is -- Who is going to tell them they are wrong!!!!

Reference was also made by Murray to this low/left thing in an earlier version of the Guide although no reference is made in the latest version I have.
Murray, Is there a reason this was changed?

Andrew

[Murray]

Originally Posted by 7,3,miss

Murray, Is there a reason this was changed?

Because I decided the others were wrong

[7,3,miss]

Murray

Because I decided the others were wrong

Sounds like a good enough reason to me

Joe

I don't think you can generalise on "the bareshaft should hit...." approach as its situation specific.

I probably should have phrased the original question differently. When I first started thinking about this, the low/left thing didnt make an awful lot of sense to me. The books/guides etc all said "this is what should happen" and I was trying to find out why this should be. I suppose, like most, I have been guilty of following the herd.
"Mr X has written it in his book/paper/website so it must be true"

Perhaps all books in the future should be supplied with "Free pinch of salt!!!"

Andrew