Clicker Problem

[geoffretired]

Archers who use clickers often have a problem with them. When I have seen an archer with a problem, more often than not,it is brought on by hesitation. The arrow is moving forwards and backwards in small tremors. This leads to the archer wondering when it will go, if ever. If this goes untreated, the archer seems to think that it is normal and does nothing about it. Or thinks it can't be right and does nothing about it;or perhaps moves it further forwards.Some throw the clicker away in disgust!
The hesitation may result from bad teaching or poor practice, but the problem is there now.Looking ahead to find a solution would seem more positive.
What do people think causes the hesitation? They seem scared of something.
What can be done to regain the confidence needed to use the clicker to their advantage?

[Little Miss Purple]

Originally Posted by geoffretired

Archers who use clickers often have a problem with them. When I have seen an archer with a problem, more often than not,it is brought on by hesitation. The arrow is moving forwards and backwards in small tremors. This leads to the archer wondering when it will go, if ever. If this goes untreated, the archer seems to think that it is normal and does nothing about it. Or thinks it can't be right and does nothing about it;or perhaps moves it further forwards.Some throw the clicker away in disgust!
The hesitation may result from bad teaching or poor practice, but the problem is there now.Looking ahead to find a solution would seem more positive.
What do people think causes the hesitation? They seem scared of something.
What can be done to regain the confidence needed to use the clicker to their advantage?

I think it comes from the initial mindset....how many people have been 'warned' about a clicker before using it?? In this game where the mental side has such an effect on the end result, I think attitudes need to change!

[TJ Mason]

Two things can cause hesitation in my case.

One is the clicker chattering as it goes over grooves and bits of straw or foam on the point - a hazard of using Cavalier clickers. I can still control myself and get a good shot though.

The other is a form of shot anticipation. I'm on target, holding nicely on target and thinking "Now! Now! Click you swine!" And all too often, this leads to a mini-collapse so I'm off-target when the clicker actually drops. If this is happening a lot, the best solution for me is to shoot a round or two without scoring. I tried blank-baling, but found it hard to motivate myself. Having a target face but not worrying about score has been more effective for me. Another good cure is to put my recurve away and shoot my compound with the release aid - this retrains me to hold on target without getting over-eager to shoot.

[ThePinkOne]

I think it's head-ology stuff.


Here's one for you. I shoot BT compound so very similar technique to shooting off a clicker. I can blank-bale no prob, but a target face on and I may struggle- timing off, hold too long etc- especially if my scope dot is too big. If I look past it, not aim just look at centre of target and pull shot through no prob. Ah, I hear you all say, target panic...

However, it isn't that simple. If I use scaled full-size faces (equivalent sight pics to 100yd, 80yd, 60yd) I have no probs. But indoor spots.... aaaagh! Even though they are the same size gold as the 60yd equiv face..... and the outer size of the spot isn't that dissimilar to the 100yd scale target total size. So I guess that partly explains why I have always been a better outdoor than indoor archer- for some reason I am able to cope with the outdoor sight image better. I don't know exactly why this happens yet, I am working empirically here, we'll sort out the theory later. I think it could be partly a subconscious colour preference thing- next thing is to experiment with different colour target faces to explore the issue more fully (I have Corel Draw and an A3 colour printer, marvellous for experimenting).

I am also recalling that when I have my eyes tested, as part of refining of the prescription the optician will get you to look at two illuminated discs, one red and one green. As different fine tuning lenses are tried you are asked which looks brighter- red or green- so there must be something in that too (I am extremely short-sighted an also have severe astigmatism in both eyes, left worse than right but with either eye I cannot see the big letter at the top of the chart without glasses). My usual shooting glasses have the specially thinned lenses- my other reactolite non-thinned ones I cannot shoot in, too much distortion- another factor maybe?

I have already stablished that the scope inserts have an impact too, and found a preferred set up with that (Beiter scopes are wonderful for playing).

OK, slightly off topic perhaps, but I do wonder: how much of any clicker problem is the physical and how much is the visual/mental?

P.

[geoffretired]

Thanks for the posts. Would you say that the final draw just before the click, is hesitant? How do you feel when it doesn't go soon enough? Do you feel a little apprehension perhaps?

[Murray]

Why is it everytime you ask a question I feel like I'm in an exam

Clickers - hesitation - discuss...

OK

IMO the key factors are:
o Focus
o Fear
o Comfort zone

Focus is number 1 because if you're thinking about the clicker, and when it will drop, your focus is in the wrong place. It will kill rhythm very quickly if your attention is on the clicker or the combination of the sight picture and clicker. I believe that one of the reasons top archers can produce a good strong shot through a clicker is they have developed a very stable sight picture, whereas most club archers tend to wander, and this exacerbates #2 - the fear. The best thing you can do as a coach is teach your archer how to "defocus" the clicker by working on Rhythm, Balance, or some internally focussed method and work with them to develop a strong form which will stabilise the sight picture.

Fear of failure - we all have it in varying degrees. The point is, when that clicker drops, you KNOW you will shoot the shot, therefore you want that clicker to drop when your sight is on the gold right? So the subconcious/subconcious goes into a battle - the concious wanting to shoot the shot, the subconcious wanting to keep the target centered - hold it longer, the tremors worsen - result: vicious circle to the point where the clicker drops anyway and the shot explodes away (who knows where). Commitment to the shot is paramount here - many archers are commited to the shot until they actualy get the gold in the sightring, and suddenly the commitment is gone and uncertainty reigns. Again, removing the desire to hit gold is about focussing within and (with much practice) increase confidence and thus reduce fear of failure.

Comfort zone - ok, so we've defocussed the clicker by working on rhythm, we've got a more stable sight picture because we've worked on shoulder alignment and balance, and we're feeling happy about this next shot - we draw up and aim. Looking good. three or four seconds go by and suddenly the concious mind alarm clock rings and we're back to thinking about the clicker. At that point, we've lost the game and a new game of "get it through the clicker" has begun... the results are predictable. So, expanding the comfort zone is a must. Look at the top archers in the world... they can shoot a shot in 3 seconds, or 10 seconds, depending on the weather - they don't freak out just because it's taking a bit longer to shoot the shot.

Practice routines to assist:
o Draw to click, then let downs - learn where the clicker is without actually shooting the arrow.
o Blank bale shooting - watch the clicker as you shoot and work on developing a smooth constant draw. When you shoot at a target later, try to keep that "smooth constant draw" feeling.
o Timing - shoot to a metronome.
o Comfront zone - deliberately hold the shot for 10 seconds *then* finish the shot.

Lots of others....

[mattfink]

Quite simply I believe it's poor clicker control. You're not going to improve it by just shooting arrows at a target, so confidence is lost aswell.

Try this; shoot 100 arrows just watching your clicker (at distance or up close, it doesn't matter) so you know where you draw to, where the point sits and how you make it go, developing a good rhythm at the same time. (Move clicker is necessary!) More importantly, this should make you more consistent with your draw, so when you move back to aiming you have the confidence that the clicker is on the tip of the point. It is crucial to maintain the same rhythm.

You can do this at any time when you feel the clicker has the better of you. It may be laborious, but does work.

[geoffretired]

Murray, sorry if I bring on examination nerves? I can't think of any other way of finding answers without asking questions.
LMP I agree with your "Bad Press" thinking. That certainly has to be improved upon.I think it is difficult to get the right balance between showing people that work needs to be done and the positives to be gained.The seriousness of it seems to translate into stress.
It is interesting how TJ's description blends in so well with Murray's advice.
TPO's ideas are similar too, though sight picture seems to feature more. Perhaps, that is related to Murray's thinking on holding steady in the gold. Could shakes become more noticeable when different colours are used for the target?
I like the defocussing idea. Like sprinters are ready to go on the B of bang. They are not crouched down simply waiting and listening and getting worked up when the starter holds them longer than they would like.
Mattfink, your ideas on contol and how to improve that, are like Murray's. What do you think robs archers of their control? Did they not have it anyway or does it go with the introduction of the clicker? Is that the result of poor training? Or does it come from their own "fear"?
Correct practice is necessary. For those with problems, will that be the same as for those who are learning for the first time? I would think so. I was told that it's a good idea to pull through the clicker on occasions, to prove that you can. If the archer feels they should abort the shot; don't just come down, but pull through with no intension of making the shot. Come down after the click.
Thanks again.

[hooktonboy]

Originally Posted by geoffretired

Archers who use clickers often have a problem with them. When I have seen an archer with a problem, more often than not,it is brought on by hesitation. The arrow is moving forwards and backwards in small tremors. This leads to the archer wondering when it will go, if ever. If this goes untreated, the archer seems to think that it is normal and does nothing about it. Or thinks it can't be right and does nothing about it;or perhaps moves it further forwards.Some throw the clicker away in disgust!
The hesitation may result from bad teaching or poor practice, but the problem is there now.Looking ahead to find a solution would seem more positive.
What do people think causes the hesitation? They seem scared of something.
What can be done to regain the confidence needed to use the clicker to their advantage?

I find that one of the problems is I think I'm still pulling when I'm not! I'm holding the bloody point with a mm still left under the clicker. I bet this looks like hesitation from the outside. I certainly find the best thing is to deliberately focus on the drawing elbow - anything but the clicker. I must look like a ruddy statue sometimes

[geoffretired]

Hooktonboy, if you think you are still drawing when you're not, join the gang! I have to ask, why do you think that applies to so many people? What is it that confuses them? For some, I think it is the way they believe they are supposed to shoot, and it's a difficult habit to break. For others, could it be that they are being confused because they take their mind of the job in hand. Like Murray says, they focus on the clicker instead of the shot sequence. Does any of that fit what you believe?