Tiller question....

[darthTer]

I noticed last night when shooting, that when I draw the string back, the sight raises up.

Am I right in thinking that this could be due to the tiller of the limbs??? If so, what do I need to adjust so that the sight pin stays where it is during draw.

Thanks

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by darthter

I noticed last night when shooting, that when I draw the string back, the sight raises up.

Am I right in thinking that this could be due to the tiller of the limbs??? If so, what do I need to adjust so that the sight pin stays where it is during draw.

Thanks

The short answer is yes it could be. If you use google or have a hunt on Sagi BB you'll find reference to the tests etc. Your tiller could be too close to 0 for the way you shoot and you can alter this by increasing the weight on your lower limb. (String to limb gap is smaller at the bottom than at the top)

However... there are a bunch of other things - including stabilisation and the way you draw the bow that affects this. And of course, if you change the tiller you need to retune.

I shot 1253 with 1/2" +ve tiller on an Avalon with C+ limbs. I shot 1254 with the same setup at 0 tiller but different stabs. Both bows aimed fine.

The more important feature for me is:

1. Are the limbs reacting well at the current tiller
2. Are your fingers comfortable at FD
3. Does the bow wander off aim after you have reached full draw and are aimed in the middle.

If 1, 2 and 3 are OK I'd leave things well alone.

Of course if you love to tinker you can have some fun experimenting!

My2p YMMV

Stretch

[EVC]

Originally Posted by Stretch

2. Are your fingers comfortable at FD

Hmmmm. It is the second or third time I see tiller associated to comfort. Is is that noticeable? I would atribute this discomfort feeling to form flaws only. What should one look (or pay attention) at to check if it is (at least in part) due to bad tillering?

3. Does the bow wander off aim after you have reached full draw and are aimed in the middle.

Again, it surprises me such an association. I would presume bow wander was related to form flaws only.

TIA.

Elder.

[Mistake]

Originally Posted by EVC

Again, it surprises me such an association. I would presume bow wander was related to form flaws only.

TIA.

Elder.

If the forces above and below the pivot point (your hand in the grip) are unequal then the bow will move towards where the greatest amount of force is. (ie: if there is more force on the bottom part of the bow then the sight gets 'pulled' down as the bow 'pulls' with more force.)

At least thats my understanding of how that works. You may need one of the many good coaches or one of the far more experianced archers than i am to explain it better

[Tropicalshot]

Originally Posted by Mistake

If the forces above and below the pivot point (your hand in the grip) are unequal then the bow will move towards where the greatest amount of force is. (ie: if there is more force on the bottom part of the bow then the sight gets 'pulled' down as the bow 'pulls' with more force.)

At least thats my understanding of how that works. You may need one of the many good coaches or one of the far more experianced archers than i am to explain it better

i agree,
if you hand is not positioned correctly in the pivot point of the grip the bow will rise, for a good tip look at or get someone to look at your long rod (giggles) when you draw, if it rises when you draw then your pressure on the grip is too low, it should remain static when drawing

[buzz lite beer]

whoa! don't rush out and start adjusting your tiller based on that experience, you need to confirm that when the sight is rising as you draw your bow that you are in fact drawing your hand back in a horizontal line, any slight downward trend as you are about to tuck into or even approach your anchor will result in the sight appearing to rise.

[Stretch]

So - I think we've all agreed - don't move your tiller Definitely agree with Buzz but if you want to do that test read up on it and get someone else to watch you - I always found it a load of b*% because by default I have to draw the bow differently from my normal draw - so when I'm at full draw my body isn't loaded in the same way so why would it aim the same way?

Regarding my comments on comfort - I've seen a lot of archers with huge blisters or callouses on their 3rd finger. A combination of style, setup etc can cause this finger to batfink on the string - reduction of tiller can make it easier to correct the fault. I've also found that when working with archers with too much tension in their drawing hand reducing tiller to 0 (limbs allowing) helps them to relax the hand but YMMV and limbs allowing.

Regarding aiming - I agree with what Mistake said pretty much. If you don't want to change stabilisation then bow tiller may get the job done. But it is all trial and error. Me I'd usually tweak stabs but I have a decent selection.

Stretch