back tension - fact or fiction ?

[pHz]

does back tension as a 'technique' in itself actually exist ?

is it a 'conscious' point of technique that can be taught or learnt ?

is it nothing more than the perceived result of good alignment and good form ?

chicken or egg ?

is it worth worrying about ?

slainte : rob

[grimsby archer]

Originally Posted by pHz

does back tension actually exist ?

yes

Originally Posted by pHz

is it a 'conscious' point of technique that can be taught or learnt ?

yes

Originally Posted by pHz

is it nothing more than the perceived result of good alignment and good form ?

no

Originally Posted by pHz

chicken or egg ?

roast dinner

Originally Posted by pHz

is it worth worrying about ?

important yes, worrying no
[/quote]

[Chris B]

Originally Posted by pHz

[color="DarkSlateBlue"]is it nothing more than the perceived result of good alignment and good form ?

chicken or egg ?

depends on whether you want it to be or not.

maybe you want to call it back tension, or maybe you want to say that if you have good alignment you have no choice but to have good back tension.

maybe you just want to call it whatever everyone else isn't calling it..

Whatever you want to call it.. or not call it.. something is happening there, in those good archers, which is distinct from other things which could happen. its important, and if you dont do it you are missing something.
The danger with saying it doesn't exist is that non-existent techniques are rather poorly defined, so if you decide the right thing to do doesnt exist, you will have no reason to do it, and you might do some.. unusual things with your shoulder & back muscles.

[geoffretired]

I can't see how a bow could be drawn, in the accepted sense, without using back muscles; and those muscles, when in use, are described as being under tension.
In my opinion, losing that tension, at the time when the release is being executed, damages scores more than worrying about whether you feel the back tension.

[Erika]

Chicken or egg? The egg came first because a chicken isn't a chicken if it didn't come from an egg.

Back tension? What ever you want to call it...

YouTube - technique back view - 28/2/08

I don't think you can pretend it doesn't exist and that it can't be taught.

[pHz]

ive maybe been a bit obtuse (as usual ? )

ive edited my OP slightly to try and clarify what debate im after

slainte rob

[Chris B]

A quote from Chris Shull (formerly of the USA national team) upon meeting one of the Korean national coaches on a training trip to Korea..

"Use bone as opposed to "use muscle". Mr Park explained that it is very confusing to your mind to think about squeezing the muscles that attach to your bones. Instead, he advocates focusing on moving the bones themselves. In this case, we are talking about scapula and elbow rotation.
Mr Park feels that the American focus on "back tension" is bogus. This reinforces use of the muscles. In Korea, everyone is taught to focus mentally on bone, with 60-70% of the national team thinking elbow specifically, and the remainder thinking scapula.
..."

This was an exerpt from only one of three such articles i have, but i can't find them on t'internet. Sorry. Anyone else?

[grimsby archer]

May I make reference to KSL and specifically section 8 on that page: 8. Loading/Transfer to Holding, paragraph 2.

That for me puts back tension in a nutshell, unless I misunderstand the question.

I am surprised how few responses this posting has gotten so far. I would have thought you'd have gotten a huge response of opinions. Is this a case of "emporer's new clothes"?

[Erika]

'Just move the bones'....

I have to admit, is a description that does my head in. I'm wondering if it's a girl thing, but none of the girls I shoot with understand that description either. And yet all of the guys thinks it makes perfect sense. Go figure.

I think about moving the draw shoulder as a whole unit around the platform of the bow shoulder/front half of the torso. I can feel the muscle under the shoulder blade (what ever it's called) take the load of the draw.

I can't separate the idea of bones from muscles and an attempt to do so just resulted in tendinitis. Your bones can move in all sorts of interesting directions if you ignore the way the muscles are meant to move.

[pHz]

Originally Posted by grimsby archer

I am surprised how few responses this posting has gotten so far. I would have thought you'd have gotten a huge response of opinions. Is this a case of "emporer's new clothes"?

im surprised too - perhaps my current vogue for vague thread titles is to blame (i did try to change it but had no luck) ?

slainte : rob