Longbow seminar with Pip Bickerstaffe

[English Bowman]

Did anyone go to the longbow seminar with Pip Bickerstaffe in Hampshire on the 9th June?
If so what did you think of it?

I thought it was interesting and worthwhile attending, although I didn't agree with everything said. There was one person there who I wish had kept his mouth shut. He insisted on arguing that Pip was wrong because he didn't agree with the Korean way of teaching. This archer couldn't accept that Longbow and Recurve were different, and may need different techniques.

Also if there was an event to raise money for the Mary Rose based on longbow shooting, in the Portsmouth area, would you want to go, what would you like it to be, and how much would you pay?
The reason I asked this is Pip would be prepared to help out in such an event, and I can probably get a venue with outdoor and indoor facilities, and we'll work on something if the interest is there.

Daniel

[Mad Archer]

A very interesting event. Well worth my fiver!

On the question of the discussion of technique, I disagree with your analysis of it. I don't believe there is a single right way to shoot (although there are clearly some ways that are never going to get you very far). I don't believe the argument was that Pip's method was wrong, but more that Pip's view that the Korean's method was necessarily damaging to archers was to be taken as gospel. I think a lot of us felt that the discussion of this went on too long, but this sort of debate is essential in the development of coaching, so it was good to have it.

I do feel that shooting a bow is the same basic function, whether you're talking about a longbow, recurve or compound, and so the discussion of technique is appicable to all these.

Interesting stuff about his conclusions of the draw weights of medieval bows (80-90# max) and the way they used arrows in battle.

[DeeH]

Originally Posted by English Bowman

Also if there was an event to raise money for the Mary Rose based on longbow shooting, in the Portsmouth area, would you want to go, what would you like it to be, and how much would you pay?

Daniel

As long as it included something for the juniors to shoot at. And a fiver to enter sounds good.

[steve58]

[quote=Mad Archer;151697]I don't believe the argument was that Pip's method was wrong, but more that Pip's view that the Korean's method was necessarily damaging to archers was to be taken as gospel.
I do feel that shooting a bow is the same basic function, whether you're talking about a longbow, recurve or compound, and so the discussion of technique is appicable to all these.
QUOTE]

Having collected a bow from Pip and spent some time discussing technique with him I know he has strong views on the subject. Why was it suggested that the Korean method was damaging to archers? I look at some archers who have adopted a very diagonal position for the legs with a very straight bow arm and think they look awfully uncomfortable and that it can't be good for the body? Interesting to read Horace Ford, with his insistence that the act of shooting, done well, should be graceful and pleasing to the eye. Perhaps this is the same as Ascham talking about "fayre shooting"? I think top performers in any sport usually have a graceful economy of movement, which some modern recurve styles lack in my eyes.

[alanesq]

Originally Posted by English Bowman

if there was an event to raise money for the Mary Rose based on longbow shooting, in the Portsmouth area, would you want to go

There is a lot of debate about the Mary Rows bows
i.e. what poundage were they, what draw length was used, what arrow heads would have been used etc. etc.

How about a fun/debate/experimentation event where anyone interested in this, warbow people, people with ideas on the subject etc. etc. all gather together and experiment shooting different equipment, show and tell their bows etc. etc.
maybe the Mary Rose people may even get involved?

Could be a fun/interesting event ?

[gwynn]

Originally Posted by alanesq

There is a lot of debate about the Mary Rows bows
i.e. what poundage were they, what draw length was used, what arrow heads would have been used etc. etc.
How about a fun/debate/experimentation event where anyone interested in this, warbow people, people with ideas on the subject etc. etc. all gather together and experiment shooting different equipment, show and tell their bows etc. etc.
maybe the Mary Rose people may even get involved?
Could be a fun/interesting event ?

been there, done it Purbrook Bowmen

[alanesq]

Do you have any details ?
What warbow people attended? I have not heard anyone talk of it

[gino]

Originally Posted by gwynn

been there, done it Purbrook Bowmen

That's a bold statement gwynn, would you care to elaborate?

I'd like to know details of:
1) what material of bows were used (plus the bowyer who made them)
2) what poundage
3) what type of string
4) the arrows
5) the targets
6) the archers involved
7) any results

Cheers.

[jb.68]

Originally Posted by gwynn

been there, done it Purbrook Bowmen

REALLY? no where on that link do I see anything like what Alan was suggesting.

[English Bowman]

We have done some tests, although not as extensive as Alan's suggestions, and it would be good to revisit them sometime with some heavier bows.
We were working with The Mary Rose Trust for a student working on his thesis, and I haven't published any results because I am waiting for the thesis to be published and marked before I make the findings public elsewhere.
The tests were more concerned with what was possible regarding accuracy and timings of longbows and crossbows, and what was possible regarding the space needed to shoot rather than range and penetration. (We have done our own range and penetration tests with our bows, but not as part of these tests)
The bows used were a mixture of warbows, and victorian style bows ranging in weight up to 90lbs. The crossbow was 250lbs and spanned with a goats foot lever.
I'll let you know more when I can

Daniel