Flat bow

[ArcherDude222]

As a recurve archer I know very little about traditional archery so bare with me!!.

Can you shoot an American flatbow in a longbow competition or longbow league?

cheers

Adam

[steve58]

Originally Posted by ArcherDude222

As a recurve archer I know very little about traditional archery so bare with me!!.

Can you shoot an American flatbow in a longbow competition or longbow league?

cheers

Adam

No!

GNAS and BLBS define the longbow very clearly and it excludes an AFB.

[Karen]

Except if you come to shoot here in France where the FITA longbow regulations apply - that includes the flatbows in the longbow (arc droit) category !

[Raedwald]

Separate classes in NFAS/EFAA rules.

[gilf]

Originally Posted by ArcherDude222

As a recurve archer I know very little about traditional archery so bare with me!!.

Can you shoot an American flatbow in a longbow competition or longbow league?

cheers

Adam

There are a couple of issues with Flatbow within a longbow competition, firstly an AFB will generally have a shelf, while longbow shoot off the hand, secondly the profile of the limbs, on longbow it's one continuous D shape, while the AFB will tend to have a small movement forward due to limb reflex.

As Karen says FITA regulations allow AFB in the longbow category, however that is more to do with the fact that what we call a longbow is different to what the rest of the world call one. For example in the US an AFB style bow is called a longbow.

I should also add there is a also a lot of fuss made about what an AFB is, while it's called an "American" flat bow, most of the bows from the US are not considered to conform to the NFAS standards due to strong limb reflex. Most of the people I shoot with who use American made bows tend to shoot in HT to avoid arguments later in the day.

[Craig P]

Very annoying the GNAS catagory is
my AFB has no shelf is long enough and conforms in almost all ways apart from being FLAT
i shoot wooden feather fletched arrows too
cant even shoot it in the barebow class cause its not a recurve

[steve58]

Originally Posted by Craig P

Very annoying the GNAS catagory is
my AFB has no shelf is long enough and conforms in almost all ways apart from being FLAT
i shoot wooden feather fletched arrows too
cant even shoot it in the barebow class cause its not a recurve

The GNAS class is clearly defined, if you want to compete with those of us shooting in it get a bow that fits the rules.

Isn't there now a class called traditional recurve or traditional barebow? Anyway, surely there's no reason you can't shoot it in the barebow category? Granted you'd be giving anyone shooting ACCs etc off a meal riser with a pressure button a head start, but there we are.

[steve58]

Originally Posted by Karen

Except if you come to shoot here in France where the FITA longbow regulations apply - that includes the flatbows in the longbow (arc droit) category !

Always wondered what French for a longbow was! Got a link to the relevant rules (in French is fine)? Is it true that in that class all sighting aids (rubber bands, markers on the ground, are banned in France?

[English Bowman]

Originally Posted by Craig P

Very annoying the GNAS catagory is
my AFB has no shelf is long enough and conforms in almost all ways apart from being FLAT
i shoot wooden feather fletched arrows too
cant even shoot it in the barebow class cause its not a recurve

It can be shot in the barebow class, or in the trad class if you shoot field archery. (Trad is not a recognised Target style.) There is nothing in the rules to say that a recurve bow has to be recurved, strange but true. The lady that won the trad section of the GNAS All British Field Championships this year was using an AFB and no-one complained. If they had they would have been laughed at. The way that the rules work (if I understand it correctly) is that you can shoot any bow provided it doesn't break the rules, so the longbow rules say that you have to have an all wood D sectioned bow, the barebow rules say that you can't have a sight, but the bow can be made in a modern design. There is nothing to say that I can't use my ELB in a barebow competition as it meets all their standards, the same is true of an AFB.
The reason that you don't see many at GNAS shoots is that they are not as easy to shoot well as modern recurve bows.

Daniel

[Karen]

All the French longbow rules are virtually the same as the FITA definitions (in English and French)
The FITA 3D Regulations for the longbow are:-

"11.10.3.4 For the Longbow Division the following items are permitted:
11.10.3.4.1 The bow shall correspond to the traditional form of a longbow with no recurve at all, which also means that when strung the string may not touch any other part of the bow but the string nocks. The bow may be made from any material or combination of material. The shape of the grip is not restricted. Center shot is allowed.
For women the bow will not be less than 150 cm in length, for men the bow will be not less than 160 cm in length – this length being measured on a strung bow between the string nocks all along the outside of the limbs.

11.10.3.4.2 A bow string of any number of strands. The string strands may be of different colours and of the material chosen for the purpose. The string may have a centre serving to accommodate the drawing fingers, a single nocking point to which may be added serving(s) to fit the arrow nock as necessary, and to locate this point one or two nock locators may be positioned (when using two nock locators the distance between the two nock locators should be such just to hold the arrownock) and at each end of the bowstring a loop to be placed in the string nocks of the bow when braced.

11.10.3.4.2.1 The serving on the string must not end within the athlete’s vision at full draw. The bowstring must not in any way assist aiming through the use of a peephole, marking, or any other means. No lip or nose mark is permitted.

11.10.3.4.3 Arrowrest. If the bow has an arrow shelf, that shelf may be used as an arrowrest and it may be covered with any type of soft material

No other types of rest will be allowed.
11.10.3.4.4 No drawcheck device may be used.
11.10.3.4.5 No sight or sightmark(s) on the bow that help aiming are allowed.
11.10.3.4.6 No weights, stabilizers or torqueflight compensators are allowed. Bowquivers cannot be attached to the bow.

11.10.3.4.7 Only wooden arrowshafts are allowed with the following specifications:
• The points will be of the field type meant for wooden arrows,
• Only natural feathers will be used as fletching.
11.10.3.4.7.1 An arrow consists of a shaft with head (point) nock, fletching
and, if desired, cresting. The maximum diameter of arrow
shafts will not exceed 9.3mm; the points (heads) for these arrows
may have a maximum diameter of 9.4mm, All arrows of every athlete must be marked with the athlete's name or initials on the shaft. All arrows used at any end will carry the same pattern and colour(s) of fletching, nocks and cresting, if any.
Arrows shall be identical in length, weight and colour, except for normal wear.
11.10.3.4.8 Finger protection in the form of finger stalls or tips, gloves, shooting tab or tape ( plaster) to draw, hold back and release the string is permitted.
11.10.3.4.8.1 The following equipment is permitted:
• On the bow hand an ordinary glove, mitten or similar item may be worn but must not be attached to the grip.
The following restrictions apply:
• The finger protection must not incorporate any device to hold, draw and release the string;
• An anchor plate or similar device attached to the finger protection (tab) for the purpose of anchoring is not permitted;
• When shooting one finger must touch the nock of the arrow. "

Also it is permitted to use Binoculars to spot arrows, but in France they have a maximum magnification of 8.5 and can only be used whilst at the peg to view the target on arrival and after the first arrow is shot. As soon as the second arrow is shot you must leave the peg. They are not allowed to be used at any other time.

All rubber bands, marks, etc are banned completely, but we're usually only shooting up to 35 or 40 metres so we go for accuracy rather than distance so maybe they wouldn't be necessary anyway - how do you aim at these distances? Personally I gap shoot, my husband does something of the 'gapstinctive' type and I have a friend who is purely instinctive, so most things are still possible, even without the artificial aid of a rubber band or marker.

Also - what we shoot here is more akin to the Hunting type 3d, as no one in their right mind would contemplate shooting a live animal with an English Longbow at the distances that some of you in the uk attempt in the 3d shoots and so I think (at risk of starting a riot) that maybe the 3d there is not really a serious attempt to imitate hunting at all. Do all animals stand at the set distance away from the archer or come with markers in front to aim at?
When hunting you need to kill the animal as quickly and cleanly as possible - therefore we score 10 for a kill and 8 for the vital organs and only 5 for a wound, while I understand in the uk it is 10 for the vital organs and still 8 for the whole of the rest of the animal. This to me is also not logical as a wound doesn't give you dinner, just an animal in pain !

Having said that I also shoot out here with another organisation (FFTL) under the IFAA rules which are the same the world over and are just as illogical !

But for me the FITA rules have got it mostly correct, I think.


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